Talk:Admin Noticeboard/Archive Tokupedia
Ninja Captor and other non-Toku shows Do you guys want to reinvestigate Ninja Captor? Seen in this mag they are classified nowhere near Sentai. They're rather placed closely to the team Metal Heroes. Not saying we should transfer them but perhaps this is more proof that Toei's distancing them from Super Sentai? :LOL, they paired it with [[w:c:metalheroes:Sekai Ninja Sen Jiraiya|Sekai Ninja Sen Jiraiya]]. That magazine certainly labels it as stand-alone anyway. So you think we should change it from revoked to Sentai-like? That status change would mean removing it from the front page menu and the season footer template. ::Probably. It's a far cry from the way it was placed years ago in the Bioman mag. But I'd like to hear your (and the other admins) opinion on this. Though I'm inclined to do so. :::If they counted, they'd probably be in the upcoming Super Hero Taisen Z, which includes the Space Sheriffs and other old heroes. Also, there's been a discussion about this before, and User:Iml908 said "At the time of the book's release, Bioman was still called the 6th Sentai, so the book could have been describing the 5 seasons before it, and 3 shows that are very similar to it (the other two being Gorenger and JAKQ)." That debunks the original source that cited it as a Sentai in the first place. Looks as if we should've made this move back in May last year. :::::Well, we could take that one user on the Kamen Rider wiki's request and adopt the Tokusatsu Wiki as a hub and place Ninja Captor as well as the other lesser known tokus there while Rangers are here, Riders are at Kamen Rider, Metal Heroes at Metal Heroes, Ultras at Ultra, etc. ::::::Questio: why do you keep pushing for Ninja Captor to be counted as a Sentai? Toei had previously counted it, but seem to have discounted it from the official Toku lineup.Gaeaman788 (talk) 07:44, January 2, 2013 (UTC) No one's "pushing" for anything Gaeaman. We work based on what references we have. In fact we're talking about doing the opposite now that we have additional references. Also, for the nth time, please indent your talk paragraphs. lol. Digi, I'll ask wikia what we can do regarding the new wiki. Unlike what we did here and at the jlu wiki, there won't be a wiki that we're admin of that we can fold it into. That is unless we actually do make a new wiki for all those adoptables. Toku is taken, so is tokusatsu. Maybe jtoku? Or we could go with Japan Heroes. Thing is it rather limits us to Japanese stuff. I agree with the idea of setting up a proper tokusatsu wiki to branch over all toku. I think that Tokupedia should be adopted, its older and a tad larger than the aforementioned toku wiki, which is barely developed. Its domain is simply "tokusatsu" rather than "tokusatsu-japan". It can be adopted since its creator and sole admin hasn't been active for nearly five years. --MrThermomanPreacher (talk) 12:58, January 2, 2013 (UTC) : If we do adopt or set up a Toku wiki, would the other wikis remain active? Bigger question is would it be too much for us to handle?Gaeaman788 (talk) 15:19, January 2, 2013 (UTC) ::Yes, it would have a basic page for each show linking to the other wikis. For example, look at our page for Kamen Rider Blade. The article mentions Decade's usage of the suit in the Shinkenger crossover, and links to it's entry at Kamen Rider Wiki. I'd use redirection, but sadly it only works within the same wiki, so a page for each show linking to it's article at The Morphin Grid, Kamen Rider Wiki or Metal Heroes Wiki would be necessary. :::Going back to Ninja Captor, it looks like its not even classifiable as "sentai-like" as it has its own thing. So once we set up a new toku wiki, I propose purging this wiki of Ninja Captor and moving everything related there. Rquinain helped point out how Toei categorizes everyone so that should be a big help. ::::So the Toku wiki would be like the BBC wiki which has pages for BBC shows with links to their wikis. On Ninja Captor, even if it was never really an official Super Sentai series at any point, I don't think it should be "purged", we have pages for other shows like Voicelugger and Sport Ranger. --MrThermomanPreacher (talk) 19:16, January 2, 2013 (UTC) True, but those shows emulate Super Sentai, while Ninja Captor didn't and can hold its own pages in the new wiki. I'm going by the logic that we consider it the way Toei does, away from Sentai. There are several sentai-like Metal Heroes, for example, and we keep them in the MH wiki. Ninja Captor can be kept in the grand toku database. And yes the BBC analogue is perfect. : Has anyone actually seen Ninja Captor though. And would English toku adapts like PR be a part of the BBCToku wiki? Since Ninja Captor visually is unlike a Sentai Show, it should go to the big toku wiki. Speaking of shows that really don't belong, arguably we could classify The Mystic Knights of Tir Na Nog as a similar thing, so should we move that show as well to this new wiki?Gaeaman788 (talk) 20:19, January 2, 2013 (UTC) ::I'm fine with whatever you guys do - personally, I would go with whatever is most recent. And if the most recent evidence says it isn't Sentai or Sentai-like, then out it goes. :::Under the proposal, Ninja Captor would be reclassified as a Sentai-like, but those would be moved to Tokusatsu Wiki, the Sentai-like category would be removed from The Morphin Grid. Gaeaman, yes, Mystic Knights would be moved there as well. The BBC wiki, which I didn't know existed, was a comparison. There's no such thing as a BBCToku wiki, lol. ::::Honestly, I'd rather we keep the other sentai-inspired shows here, as they're sentai inspired, unlike Ninja Captors that made it way before the Super Sentai franchise. :::::I don't think there's enough sentai-like shows to justify another wiki, honestly. ::::::Well, yes. It's entirely different content in the new wiki.It'll contain (along with Ninja Captor) all the rest of those shows in that book and the minor ones as well. I propose keep PR/Super Sentai and sentai-inspired shows here, MH and KR where they are (which is you guys' idea as well) and the one-off toku shows in the new wiki. ::::::: Yeah, I was about to say, what about the other Ishinomori heroes? They're not Sentai-like. Some of them have appeared in Kamen Rider movies and will be in Super Hero Taisen Z, but at the moment, there isn't a suitable place for us to put info about their own shows. ::::::::Precisely. The new wiki will be the perfect location for them. I don't know much about these shows, but if you want my help running it, I'll volunteer to help keep an eye on it. Same with the other wikis. :One of us needs to edit some pages at http://tokusatsu.wikia.com before we'll be able to adopt it, per Adoption Requests. ::I have a good record with merges, I can do it if you guys want. Then I'll bring you guys over. :::Sounds good to me. If the adoption goes fast, perhaps it would be ready before I get off work. ::::Do we ask for these URLs below to be folded into tokusatsu.wikia? :::::Garo Ryukendo Tomica Hero Toku I've just checked on each of those and all of them only had one admin. Ryukendo's founder had never even edited the wiki! I copied your message onto the admins userpages, which should trigger a notification. Give them a couple of days to respond, but I'm certain that the Toku and Ryukendo admins aren't active. By the way, you forgot that SigReal doesn't exist on those other wikis - next time you post a message without copying that over, you should sign with ' Dchallofjustice (talk) ~~~~~' instead of ~~~. :Yeah but I just left the sigreal version anyway since the leftover has a timestamp. lol. As for the amount of days, as with Super Sentai and JLU, a week on the main talk page and they'll be eligible for merge if there are no responses. As for tokupedia we should start working on it. Maybe start moving templates. So the wikia team can see that we're organizing it. ::Made a start by updating the Kamen Rider series page both at tokusatsu: and kamenrider: (each had info missing from the other), creating a proper Metal Heroes series page, since the existing one was just a list of shows (the new one was simply copied from it's counterpart at metalheroes:), and adding the all important reflist template, as well as uploading a couple of images for the Super Sentai and Metal Heroes pages. By the way, did you not know that five tildes gives the timestamp without actually signing your name? :::(posting from work via mobile) I knew that :) ::::so all of these shows will be under a tokusatsu wiki, even though something like mystic knights isn't tokusatsuGaeaman788 (talk) 19:57, January 4, 2013 (UTC) :::::Digifiend, I did not know that. LOL. But like I said, I just left it there anyway. Haha. I'm not so familiar with Mystic Knights. Is is a transformational superhero show? If it is, then might as well. The Philippine show "Darna" was brought over to Japan and considered Toku as well, so that goes on there too. ::::::Mystic Knights is toku. Tokusatsu means special effects, it isn't just Japanese stuff. That new Chinese show counts too. :::::::You mean Jushen ZahnJiDui? While we're on the subject of China, Armor Hero and Armor Hero XT count as well. Aldo The Fox (talk) 21:02, January 4, 2013 (UTC) (68.75.16.20 with new nametag) ::::::::Yeah, the Japanese market does count imported Western programs like Doctor Who, Stargate, Red Dwarf, Thunderbirds, and even Thomas the Tank Engine as tokusatsu. So toku.wikia will be redirected to tokusatsu.wikia but Ryukendo, Garo, and Tomica Hero will as well? Shouldn't they be allowed to have their own wikis as Sentai, Rider, and Metal Heroes are. --MrThermomanPreacher (talk) 21:10, January 4, 2013 (UTC) :::::::::Yes, those three shows should be allowed to have their own wikis. I was referring to the link buttons on the front page being expanded to feature those toku wikis. Tokupedia could serve as the main junction for those wikis via front page link buttons as well as the hub of Non-Toei and Toei toku heroes who don't fit the criteria of any of our wikis. Aldo The Fox (talk) 22:16, January 4, 2013 (UTC) ::::::::::Also, I found another one that could be brought into the fold: http://gransazer.wikia.com/wiki/GranSazers_Wiki renaming it Chouseishin Wiki (if possible) seems reasonable since the show was part of a trilogy in a shared universe. Contact the admin and see what he says or see if any ones there Aldo The Fox (talk) 22:16, January 4, 2013 (UTC) Yes Aldo, that's the one I meant, and we do currently have a page for it here: Jushen ZhanJiDui. Of course, we'd be focusing only on henshin hero shows (the Western shows Preacher mentioned all have their own wikis with strong userbases), but as I said, not being Japanese certainly doesn't make it not toku. Mystic Knights of Tir Na Nog, along with Tattooed Teenage Alien Fighters from Beverly Hills, Superhuman Samurai SyberSquad, VR Troopers, BeetleBorgs, Masked Rider and Power Rangers, are collectively nicknamed the Ameritokus. Short for "American Tokusatsu shows". About your other point, there's no point in the other shows having their own wikis if nobody's editing them though, is there? Also, the Ameritokus are no longer airing, meaning they have a short history and not much room for expansion. Gaeaman788 (talk) 18:09, January 8, 2013 (UTC) :Apart from PR of course. Tokupedia discussion http://tokusatsu.wikia.com/wiki/Main_Page Okay, so the first thing we have to decide is what is and isn't off limits so we have a general grasp of what we're aiming for. While it is true that shows that feature special effects are considered tokusatsu, I worry that might make things a little murky at best. We need to establish some kind ground rules so things don't get out of hand. Digifiend did bring up a good point about wikis having no point if no one is there to edit and maintain them. With that in mind, what should we do with the abandoned wikis that contain info on Garo,Ryukendo,Tomica Hero, Chou Sei Shin and Zone Fighter. Should we adopt and keep them? Delete them and move the info to Tokupedia? (I'm aware we are trying to do the former on some of them. I just want the community's opinions on the matter for debate.) I just want a clear picture of what we are going to do so that I can aid you as best as I can on the project Aldo The Fox (talk) 01:50, January 5, 2013 (UTC) :I say we take them and redirect to tokupedia or we'll have too little info, most aren't that big in scope anyway. : Most with the exception being Garo, 2 seasons for grand total of 50 episodes (with a 3rd season on the way this year) 2 specials, 2 films, merchandise and its own universe of characters. This franchise has the possibility that it may expand even further...Aldo The Fox (talk) 23:24, January 9, 2013 (UTC) ::Hmm. I wonder how big of a project we'll want to make this. I also think it would benefit to combine adminship across all the wikis rather than hit and miss, so we all can keep an eye on all of them. Especially if we're keeping a bunch of the separate, little ones. Even with Garo getting a third season, how long will the franchise go? So far we've conceptually gotten Garo, Ryukendo, Tomica Hero, Chou Sei Shin, and Zone Fighter. And that doesn't include AmeriTokus which will probably need to go somewhere. And what of the Sentai-like shows like Ninja Captor (which isn't a Sentai) or Pretty Guardian Sailor Moon? ::I think we should do this one step at a time. Tokupedia should be the catch-all for anything that doesn't fit in with Sentai/PR, Kamen Rider, or Metal Heroes. Garo maybe on its own depending on how big it gets. Step 1 should be what all could we include, and what should we include? ::Good points all around, Garo's third season could be its last for all I know. I guess I am getting a little carried away. As for Pretty Guardian, doesn't WikiMoon have that covered? So that one could be a short redirect to their page or ask editors they have to assist us in developing the page. Aldo The Fox (talk) 00:20, January 10, 2013 (UTC) ::Oh and I checked the Gransazer wiki and it appears to be a hub for torrents of the show. I haven't read the Copyright policy for wikia but i'm kinda-sorta sure we're not supposed to be doing stuff like that. Aldo The Fox (talk) 00:20, January 10, 2013 (UTC) :::Hmm, I see pctorrentdownloads got shut down, probably because of this rule: You agree not to use the Service to post any illegal or unauthorized content or use for any illegal or unauthorized purposes. That's from Terms of Use. ::::Ugh, The founder of the Gransazer wiki is at it again.... http://gransazer.wikia.com/wiki/Episodes_Download ::::I put up the deletion tag, but something needs to be done about him if we want the data to the wiki.Aldo The Fox (talk) 22:29, January 16, 2013 (UTC) :::::Well I wouldn't tag it for deletion, because while it is a TOS violation, as admin of the wiki he can just go back and remove the delete tag while doing nothing. If you want Wikia to take action, you need to take it to them, where he can't get in the way. :::::: Well then should I report it at w:c:vstf:Report:Wiki? Here's what I'll put: :::::::That sounds like a much better conclusion, I'd say. ::::::::Oh, just noticed "Powered by Wikipedia" on the Gransazer Wiki homepage. That means all the data there is copy/pasted anyway, and we should probably start from scratch. There was another page of illegal downloads, by the way. I'm going to not even mention the Tokupedia thing on VSTF now, there's no reason to keep the wiki active. We probably can't use any of the data from Gransazers wiki anyway. I'll take the action in morning, to allow more time for comment, but I'm now thinking of using this version: :::: Well Chief, the results came back: http://community.wikia.com/wiki/Adoption:Tokusatsu_Wiki :::: It looks like we won't be getting the wiki just yet... we need more edits to convince the higher-ups we can take care of it. Aldo The Fox (talk) 04:47, January 14, 2013 (UTC) Looks like a more concrete "what to do note", which is good. Since the main page is unlocked I can bring over the "programming" we developed for the KR, MH and PR wikis to there. Will do so tonight. Another quick adoption update involving the project: http://community.wikia.com/wiki/Adoption:Kikaider_Wiki?t=20130117024048 Aldo The Fox (talk) 03:39, January 19, 2013 (UTC) New interwiki link templates! Because laziness is the mother of invention, and efficiency its uncle (yeah, I made that last part up) we have new interwiki templates that work on powerrangers, metalheroes, kamenrider and tokusatsu addresses of wikia. I initially had explanations on them as well, but unfortunately they cause breakage in pages, even moreso when used in bullets. One other drawback is, for now, you can only use the exact page name. If not, say you wanna cover the link All Riders with Most Riders, you'll have to use the old. The way it works is instead of typing All Riders, you only need type . This should help us manage cross-article writing better. Available in KR (kamenrider), PR (supersentai/powerrangers), MH (metalheroes) and TK (tokusatsu) where applicable. :I've put in a request for help so we can add a second field to the templates and hide links behind other text. ::Pecoes at the wikia community responded expressly and provided us with codes. The interwiki links can now hide links behind text like a regular link. Cross-series idea Since we have access to Tokupedia, how about making it the hub of non-series specific crossovers between Super Sentai, Kamen Rider and Metal Heroes? (For now mainly the Super Hero Taisen movies) With the new cross-links, it'll be much easier to manage one article in a main-hub type of location, as opposed to duplicate information. Just a thought. :You mean like the Super Hero Operations RPG games or the Ultraman vs. Kamen Rider special? Yeah, sounds good. :Nbajammer said that we should redirect the abandoned wikis I talked about to Tokupedia and use what they have to expand the project. He may be right... nothing against the fans of these shows but ..... :I've started thinking that maybe the small independent wikis would seem a bit redundant if we have a catch-all wiki that can be neatly organized to showcase the heroes and shows in categories. Maybe it would be a better idea and less time consuming on the long-term management side if we had 5 wikis instead of 13 scattered about.... (Ultraman, Kamen Rider, Metal Heroes, Morphing Grid, Tokupedia for everything else, and maybe a link to Wikizilla on the Tokupedia main page) I'm still kind of torn on the issue, I want to respect the fans who made them, but we need efficiency to keep these wikis running so merging makes sense. --Aldo The Fox (talk) 18:52, January 14, 2013 (UTC) ::If those fans couldn't be bothered to maintain them, then there's no harm being done. In fact, I'd say they're the ones being disrespectful to their fandoms by not finishing what they started. To be honest, if someone has abandoned their wiki, they won't care what we do to them. :::Exactly, but by running 13 wikis, we admins are spreading ourselves thin. For starters, it would help to have the same admins on each wiki. Then, as Aldo pointed out, I would redirect the lesser titles to Tokupedia rather than maintain seperate wikis for each series. Much like how powerrangers.wikia.com and supersentai.wikia.com both redirect here. But Aldo, Digifiend is also right - they're the disrespectful ones if they couldn't be bothered so we should. The problem is how we should go about it. ::::I'm already lost with what we're doing and what is going where -_-Gaeaman788 (talk) 23:13, January 14, 2013 (UTC) :::::Basically, as I understand it the idea is to create a toku community of wikis here on Wikia, using our current Morphin Grid, Kamen Rider, and Metal Heroes wikias as the foundation. We plan to take over tokusatsu.wikia.com (aka Tokupedia), and use it as a hub of sorts, as well as reference points to the various tokus on their wikias. The idea was to take over other abandoned wikias for toku shows and how we can incorporate them into the fold either by taking them over and redirecting them, or copying their info onto Tokupedia if they aren't big enough for their own wikia. Let me try and break down the action plan as well as try and glue together what's been discussed. # Request adoption of Tokusatsu.wikia (done, given "to-do" list) # Ask to merge/adopt Garo, Toku and other abandoned wikis (within those wikis' communities) into Tokusatsu.wikia (in progress # Format and add "Hero", "Kaiju" and "Kaijin" LIVE ACTION content to Tokusatsu.wikia # Move all "colored team" articles to Tokusatsu except those directly inspired by Sentai # Develop cross-wiki easy linking (done) # Treat tokusatsu.wikia as the central crossover hub (i.e. move Super Hero Taisen, or cross franchise VS there, but NOT include episodes with a lead franchise like Decade in Shinkenger, and Shinkenger in Decade) This is to avoid massive duplication. # After a week since community.wikia's reminder, and heavy workload, follow up on tokusatsu.wikia adoption # After adoption, request mergers (this time from community.wikia) :As for what to put perhaps Japanese toku (hero, kaiju or kaijin- there are templates now available), international shows that outright are inspired by toku, or international shows that are brought to Japan and labeled Toku (disincluding the Hollywood Sci-fi genre). Perhaps those three sets will help us figure out what goes on and what doesn't and prevents us from just adding every single sci-fi known to man. ::Well, if it's not live action, it's out straight away. This eliminates things like the Gerry Anderson shows such as Thunderbirds, which already has a large wiki anyway. It also rules out anime like Gatchaman and all Sailor Moon iterations except Pretty Guardian (those two franchises have decent wikis already anyhow). The upcoming Gatchaman movie would count though. Doctor Who and it's spin-offs, as well as Primeval, certainly would be classed as tokus in Japan, but not in the UK where they originate. They also have their own wikis anyway (Tardis Data Core, as Doctor Who's is now named, is one of the biggest on Wikia). You see the pattern right? We could do a list page, listing everything which would be considered toku in Japan, but not by us, and linking to the relevant wikis for those shows. That should then leave us with just the Sentai-likes and Japanese action shows. :::Fantastic idea. Maybe a StyleGuide page specific to Tokupedia, "non-listable franchises" or some sort. I see no one seems to mind the idea of using Tokupedia as crossover central as well. I'll start importing later on. We should start considering cross-liki importing as checking on "what links here" as well and updating the necessary links to crossovers from various pages.